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sayheykid1 Profile
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Re: The Official Clean House Thread.


quote:

Freshbreaker wrote:

quote:

barrance wrote:

The team was 72-90 last year and assuming they go 5-5 these last 10, they will be 87-75. That's a 15 game swing from one year to the next. I would say that's a pretty good turnaround.



So that saves Bochy's job? Why? I know it likely will, but what did Bochy have to do with the 15 game swing.



Jebus, dude. You claim he had no talent yet he led the team to a 15 game swing? He mixed and matched lineupos quite well IMO.
9/24/2009, 11:06 pm Link to this post   
 
Bhaakon Profile
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Re: The Official Clean House Thread.


quote:

Are you trying to say that Lewis is the Giants 2nd best outfielder?



As a hitter, yeah. Maybe 1st, if you want to discount Torres for having half as many at bats.
9/24/2009, 11:07 pm Link to this post   
 
sayheykid1 Profile
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Re: The Official Clean House Thread.


quote:

SRPwrd wrote:

Here is a poll from earlier this season.

[sign in to see URL]|pleasedo=pollviewresults



Oh SNAP

Well done
9/24/2009, 11:08 pm Link to this post   
 
sayheykid1 Profile
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Re: The Official Clean House Thread.


quote:

Freshbreaker wrote:

quote:

sayheykid1 wrote:

quote:

Freshbreaker wrote:

Duke, I'm counting on you to do what's best for the organization. Fire Bruce Bochy and the puppeteer who hired him.

A six year playoff drought is not Teh Giant Way. Trading top prospects for guys who are far from difference makers is not the Giant Way either. Signing guys who look good crashing into fences but can't distinguish a strike zone isn't either.

This clown called Brian and his little buddy Bochy need to. Be wiped from the organizational map.



If someone would have told you on March 1st that the Giants would win 85+ games and Bochy had to run a different lineu out everyday to do it. Would you have said he should lose his job?
I think he may be a MOY candidate.



We don't have to look beyond the last 4 hours to understand the case against Bochy. It's not like he's getting fired in the middle of a contract. His deal is up, and I respectfully disagree with your opinion.



I am a baseball fan who knows that I need to look at the expectations coming into a season and the season as a whole with all of the things somneone had to overcome to judge a manager.
You seem to think Sabes built a crappy team and Bochy should have won 90+ with it.
9/24/2009, 11:12 pm Link to this post   
 
Freshbreaker Profile
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Re: The Official Clean House Thread.


quote:

sayheykid1 wrote:

quote:

Freshbreaker wrote:

quote:

sayheykid1 wrote:

quote:

Freshbreaker wrote:

Duke, I'm counting on you to do what's best for the organization. Fire Bruce Bochy and the puppeteer who hired him.

A six year playoff drought is not Teh Giant Way. Trading top prospects for guys who are far from difference makers is not the Giant Way either. Signing guys who look good crashing into fences but can't distinguish a strike zone isn't either.

This clown called Brian and his little buddy Bochy need to. Be wiped from the organizational map.



If someone would have told you on March 1st that the Giants would win 85+ games and Bochy had to run a different lineu out everyday to do it. Would you have said he should lose his job?
I think he may be a MOY candidate.



We don't have to look beyond the last 4 hours to understand the case against Bochy. It's not like he's getting fired in the middle of a contract. His deal is up, and I respectfully disagree with your opinion.



I am a baseball fan who knows that I need to look at the expectations coming into a season and the season as a whole with all of the things somneone had to overcome to judge a manager.
You seem to think Sabes built a crappy team and Bochy should have won 90+ with it.



Vegas had the Giants at 80.5 wins. and that poll really doesn't say much. 9 people out of 18 had them at 77 wins. That's within 4 of .500. My post said "Somewhere around .500" If 78, 79 were options we might have a clearer picture. I've been wasting my time looking for more opinions from March and April bit there isn't a lot. I did find this thread, Chef is on the record with 84. FSS wasn't touching 80.5 and Malcontent indicated he agreed. The best I did was agree that the Giants were much improved do to the Affeldt Howry and RJ acquisitions.

VASF's point was that the consensus was that the Giants wouldn't be anywhere near .500. I think I'm closer to the truth in saying that most thought the Giants would be somewhere near .500. It doesn't matter though. Regardless the Giants have outperformed expectations, I credit the players despite Bochy's innumerable gaffes and others just accept that the only reason the Giants are sniffing contention is Bruce Bochy. I disagree.

Here's the thread I referenced.

[sign in to see URL]

Last edited by Freshbreaker, 9/24/2009, 11:45 pm


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Travis Ishikawa is NOT a competent first baseman.
9/24/2009, 11:36 pm Link to this post   
 
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Re: The Official Clean House Thread.


quote:

I see the Mormon church doesn't teach reading.



Not really sure what the point of this is, other than a thinly veiled attempt to put down my religion, which has absolutely nothing to do with the argument. Talk about your non-sequiturs.


quote:

Ok, to recapitulate, you'll note for instance that I didn't say anything about YOU pantshitting, but rather it was directed to the majority of this board that was screaming about how shitty the team was and would be.



I deeply apologize for misunderstanding that your statements that you directed to me by quoting my post weren't directed at me even though I was responding to this:
quote:



Oh, puh-leeze. MODERATELY exceeded expectations? Expecting around .500??? That's historical revisionism at its worst.



I guess you could have been talking to ninebuck there, or maybe Bhaakon, I don't know.

quote:


  I haven't a clue whether you were among them (though i wouldn't be surprised if you were, since your opinions about the Giants seem to wax and wane with your menstrual cycle).



Really. Wow. Doin' it with class.

quote:


 As far as how the people on this board felt, I direct you to Merkin's reposting of the board poll that was done. Looks to me like maybe 3/4s were predicting sub-500 ball, and some were projecting performance well below that. In fact, as many people thought the Giants would be TEN games or more below 500 as all those who said they would be at 500 or above! So I was correct about what I said about people expecting a poor showing this year, and you were WRONG about people generally expecting .500.



We're both looking at a glass with .50 volume of water.


quote:

You say that you were expecting 500, ok, I'll accept that...


Awesome. I feel so much better.


quote:

though I'd be happy to see you repost a pre-April statement where you publicly stated that.



I tried, all I could find was a thread stating the 80.5 vegas over/under and me agreeing the team was much improved.

[sign in to see URL]


quote:

But in any event, stop being such a narcissist and interpreting everything I said as being about YOU. Very little about what I said had anything to do about you.



Yeah, you quoted my post in a thread I started and responded directly to a claim I made. Sure, it had nothing to do with me. My mistake.

quote:


However, THIS is directed toward [sign in to see URL] up.



I'm working on it. I tried not to insult your religion, whatever that might be.

quote:


To answer your nonsequitur of a question about Sabean and Bochy



You misunderstood the thread title?

quote:

(what I originally wrote had NO logical relationship to my feelings about them)



Exactly, I was trying to bring you back around to the topic.

The rest of this looks like a well thought out, relevant response. Thanks.

quote:


...I'm honestly ambivalent. Normally I think someone who has produced the improvement they have should be rewarded with a contract extension. But in their case, I'm not so sure. I think a fair assessment of Bochy is that he is a solid manager, probably in the average to slightly-above-average range, but nobody's going to confuse him with Jim Leyland. If we fire him, I won't lose sleep over it but on the other hand I think we could do far worse. The facile suggestions I see people make (e.g., promote Steve Decker, hire Tony LaRussa) sound nice superficially but I'm not convinced either would work. (i.e., speaking somewhat metaphorically, Norwich is a long way from San Francisco.) Anyone else, hell, they may improve on Bochy but maybe not.

I've been a defender of Sabean in the past, but I'm wobbling. I think he's good at evaluating talent and would be thrilled if he were the Giants farm director. Unfortunately, as GM his tendency to overpay and overrely on mid- to late-career vets disturbs me and I HATE (repeat, HATE) his reflexive tendency to trade young talent for old guys who might help us win this year. I get that he says when you have a chance to win you have to go for it, BUT if you let your farm talent ripen maybe you win MORE in the future and in any event his trades seem to constantly turn belly-up. I wasn't crazy about Sanchez for Alderson at the time but I thought, ok, I can live with it. But I HATED (repeat, HATED) the Garko for Barnes trade. And as it turns out, both trades did NOTHING for us. Again, there's the matter of if you dump a competent GM like Sabean, can you replace him with someone better? So I wouldn't rush out to fire him, but if it happens, fine.

Of the two, I'm arguably more in favor of dumping Sabean than Bochy.






Last edited by Freshbreaker, 9/24/2009, 11:58 pm


---
Travis Ishikawa is NOT a competent first baseman.
9/24/2009, 11:57 pm Link to this post   
 
MarcoPolo666 Profile
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The Official Clean House Thread.


Statistics. Interesting subject. Besides the fact that 77-85 is EIGHT games under break-even (not 4), I wouldn't call 77-85 "Somewhere around .500". Well, not unless 85-77 is also "Somewhere around .500" and nobody should be surprised when the Giants finish at about that number because "it's close to .500, where everybody thought they would be".
9/25/2009, 5:04 am Link to this post   
 
4u2 Hugo Profile
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Re: The Official Clean House Thread.


quote:

Bhaakon wrote:

quote:

Are you trying to say that Lewis is the Giants 2nd best outfielder?



As a hitter, yeah. Maybe 1st, if you want to discount Torres for having half as many at bats.



My first response was going to be to disagree with that. But upon reflection, yeah, maybe he is their best hitting outfielder. But what does that say about how bad their outfielders hit?

Watching Lewis all year, waiting for him to break out and separate himself from the others, hitting for avg and power. Just never saw it consistently.

Question is, what to do with Lewis. The potential seems to be there. He obviously has speed and power. When if ever will the whole package come forth?

His defense is a whole different topic. He's just plain scary to watch in the outfield.
9/25/2009, 7:27 am Link to this post   
 
Freshbreaker Profile
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The Official Clean House Thread.


Marco you can be such a tool sometimes. So using your logic if the team had 4 more wins they'd be 81-85. I guess that might make sense in a 166 game season. I never said everyone thought that either. I said it seemed to me that the concensus was around .500. I guess I was wrong of that makes you happy.

Tool.

Last edited by Freshbreaker, 9/25/2009, 7:54 am


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Travis Ishikawa is NOT a competent first baseman.
9/25/2009, 7:48 am Link to this post   
 
FSS Profile
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The Official Clean House Thread.


Giants bet golden, Padres bet [sign in to see URL] bad I put more $$$ on the Padres. How they didn't lose a 100 games, I'll never [sign in to see URL] runs for/runs against differential in the league. F me.
9/25/2009, 7:59 am Link to this post   
 


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