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haters Profile
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While I am all for getting rid of Sabean does anyone really think that he was the only GM in baseball that allowed this to happen or turned a blind eye?
There is a lot of pressure on GM's to win and I would assume that they are just as eager to find an edge as the players are. Face it, when competition enters the equations some people will quickly shed their morals and it appears that Sabean is one of those. I would assume however that he is part of the majority.
12/13/2007, 4:13 pm Link to this post   
 
22TheThrill Profile
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Re: …


quote:

haters wrote:

While I am all for getting rid of Sabean does anyone really think that he was the only GM in baseball that allowed this to happen or turned a blind eye?
There is a lot of pressure on GM's to win and I would assume that they are just as eager to find an edge as the players are. Face it, when competition enters the equations some people will quickly shed their morals and it appears that Sabean is one of those. I would assume however that he is part of the majority.




This may be true however, it appears that Sabean is the only GM mentioned in the report and the statements about his lack of involvement, even when asked to get involved by Stan Conte, indicates to me a grievous lack of judgement on Sabean's part.

Just sayin'


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Baseball is like church. Many attend but few understand.
Leo Durocher



12/13/2007, 4:18 pm Link to this post   
 
MarcoPolo666 Profile
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LIVING LEGEND
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Re: Sabean's actions noted in the Mitchell report.


quote:

22TheThrill wrote:

The Giants did eventually ban a lot of Bonds' entourage and trainers from the club house albeit after the BALCO stuff came to light.




Actually, Major League Baseball banned them - they changed the rule, and said that only employees of the TEAM are allowed in the clubhouse and facilities. All the Giants did was refuse to "hire" Bonds' trainer(s).

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12/13/2007, 4:25 pm Link to this post   
 
22TheThrill Profile
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Re: Sabean's actions noted in the Mitchell report.


quote:

MarcoPolo666 wrote:

quote:

22TheThrill wrote:

The Giants did eventually ban a lot of Bonds' entourage and trainers from the club house albeit after the BALCO stuff came to light.




Actually, Major League Baseball banned them - they changed the rule, and said that only employees of the TEAM are allowed in the clubhouse and facilities. All the Giants did was refuse to "hire" Bonds' trainer(s).



That's correct. Thanks for the post. In fact, the Mitchel report talks about how the head of security for MLB talked to Stan Conte and said that they would be of help.

It's just sad that Sabean and the Giants couldn't or wouldn't control their own clubhouse.

Just sayin'

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Baseball is like church. Many attend but few understand.
Leo Durocher



12/13/2007, 4:28 pm Link to this post   
 
chefjuan Profile
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Re: Sabean's actions noted in the Mitchell report.


quote:

22TheThrill wrote:

It's just sad that Sabean and the Giants couldn't or wouldn't control their own clubhouse.

Just sayin'



It is sad. And that incompetence spills into every other aspect of the organization from Sabean down.

This definitely brings Bri-Bri's character into question. He could be the poster boy for the FO Exec who consciously looked the other way to save his own hide. He's a disgrace. He showed his lack of integrity and at the same time ran one of the most historic and winningiest teams in American sports into the ground. All by himself.

Just step down, Brian. Or die. either will do...

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12/13/2007, 5:47 pm Link to this post   
 
chefjuan Profile
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Re: Sabean's actions noted in the Mitchell report.


I called into the Razor and Mr. T to vent on this. Basically I said that Sabean should either resign or Magowan should fire him to send a message that the Giants are better than that.

They claimed that all the GMs were equally guilty, but I don't buy that. I don't believe it's just a coincidence that only 2-3 GMs came up in this report.

Thrill, what you say about Sabean character is dead on. I think, no matter what you feel about Sabean's moves or how he's done as a GM, you can't argue that he did the right thing. Did he have to report this to MLB? Not neccesarily. But he should have stood up and done SOMETHING. Kick out Barry's entourage or even confront Bonds. Anything but making Conte (essentially a support staff employee) to take care of the dirty work. A good boss takes responsibility for important matters and deals with crisis. As the redneck kid on the Real world said "A man is not a measure of how much he can drink or how much ass he can kick, but how he handles himself in a crisis"

I admit, I bring this up because I want Sabean gone for baseball reasons. But there is no denying he let the Giants organization down by allowing all the crap to happen on his watch. Who knows? Maybe Sabean confronts Bonds and nips this in the bud and Balco/Bonds/Anderson never goes down the way it did.

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"If the Pilgrims had landed in California the East Coast would still be wilderness"
12/13/2007, 7:43 pm Link to this post   
 
Bhaakon Profile
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Sabean's actions noted in the Mitchell report.


I'm split.


I don't like Sabean, but it's hard to tell if the buck stops with him, or if he was following a mandate from ownership and now Magowan is throwing Sabes under the bus. Ownership certainly had every reason to both ride the Bonds cash cow into the ground and deny everything.
12/13/2007, 8:33 pm Link to this post   
 
chefjuan Profile
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Re: Sabean's actions noted in the Mitchell report.


quote:

Bhaakon wrote:

I'm split.


I don't like Sabean, but it's hard to tell if the buck stops with him, or if he was following a mandate from ownership and now Magowan is throwing Sabes under the bus. Ownership certainly had every reason to both ride the Bonds cash cow into the ground and deny everything.



That's a fair point. But I here so many media guys call Magowan an honest guy, and after that little thing in the report, I think he really had no idea. I just get the impression that he didn't want to be involved, so he asked Bonds if there was anything to be involved about.

So I do think the buck should stop at Sabean. He's the man responsible for running the team. He's hired to take care of the product on the field, and everything involved with putting that product there.

I'm not saying Pink Pete is without some sort of blame, but he's seems like a guy who really doesn't know what's going on with the baseball operations. (as evidence of Teh Extension). I don't think he talks to players beyond the big guys like Bonds. And I don't think he's as greedy and evil as they paint the steroids owners to be. Steroids or not, the Giants had the nicest park in the country and a team that was in the playoff hunt every year. Barry's 73 HRs in 2001 didn't really make that big of a difference. They were selling out every game anyway.

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"If the Pilgrims had landed in California the East Coast would still be wilderness"
12/13/2007, 8:59 pm Link to this post   
 
losgigantes Profile
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Sabean's actions noted in the Mitchell report.


Sabes had nothing to do with it. Magowan runs this show. Can you imagine what would happen if Sabes pissed off Bonds and Barry had a little chat with Magowan?

As Sabes has famously said "I am not an idiot"

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12/13/2007, 9:04 pm Link to this post   
 
Bhaakon Profile
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Sabean's actions noted in the Mitchell report.


You really think they'd have been winning or selling out if they'd exposed Bonds? It's one thing to say that Magowan wasn't involved directly with baseball operations, but he shows up to most every game, he's clearly a fan, and fans have been suspicious since at least 2001. If he wasn't actively covering things up, he was certainly perpetuating a policy of willful ignorance.

Also, his comments to Sabean about whether the team had anything to worry about have been taken to mean whether Bonds was on something, but it's equally (if not more) likely that he simply wanted to know if the team had any legal liabilities (like, for instance, if the training staff was itself distributing).
12/13/2007, 9:07 pm Link to this post   
 


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